My thoughts on Utah's Management Plan

Post by **MuleyMadness** » Thu Jul 27, 2006 7:52 am

So I did the math...Colorado has estimated population of 600,000 deer in 2005 and gave out 91,757 tags. That is 15.29% of the deer they are allowing to be killed or hunted.

Utah in 2005 has an estimated population of 280,000 deer and gave out 97,000 tags which is 34.64%.

Wow that is staggering, how can you afford to take out that percentange of any Big Game species each year? Crazy, no way they will rebound or increase in numbers. Now I know not all hunters are successful or kill that many bucks. But consider the wounded deer that die, road kill, predation, starvation, winter range, feed, etc. And no wonder we can't improve out herds.

Speaking of road kill, Utah as an average of 6,600 to 8,800 Big Game road kills per year, 98% of which are deer.

I also checked the checked the report and in 2002 hunters killed about 48,000 deer.

So lets see... 48,000 deer harvested
8,800 road kill
? wounded/dead
? predation
? starvation/illness

Thats 56,800 out of a population of 280,000 deer. Can we afford to WIPE OUT 20.28% of our deer herd every year? I say NO WAY. Remember these numbers are only harvested and road kill deer.

Also what about ELK? IMO they are part of the problem and adding to the decline in Utah’s deer herd.

So it brings me back to the bottom line...the mighty DOLLAR!! The budget is what it is and is only screaming for more.

We need to listen to the "people" the average hunters and organizations.

The internet has been literally littered with discussion, debate, anger, frustration, and even worse than that in some cases. I've read and seen literallly hundreds of excellent points. So is the voice of the hunters being listened to or heard....(maybe)...taken seriously...(I doubt it)

Cut tags, close areas, help winter range, manage predation, can Deer and Elk co-habitat?? etc., etc., etc., these are big issues with a lot of work and effort to solve.

I'm glad for those who are striving to improve the heard and say THANKS. For those who are focused on simply MONEY, SAD!!

So you mature hunters, leave the immature bucks alone. For you youngsters bag a 2-point this fall, heck even a spike. And enjoy the experience with your friends/family.

As for me and my house...we will go hard or go home empty handed this fall. Meaning I want a crack at a decent buck, which is becoming difficult in many areas.

There is still a few good areas, maybe I'll get lucky...

But that hasn't happened to me since 1999 in Utah's general season.

Post by **MuleyMadness** » Thu Jul 27, 2006 7:53 am

Another question I have is why does Utah only manage for a buck to doe ratio of 15 bucks per 100 does???

The only exception is limited entry units which are higher. But heck we only have 3 of these in the state. We need a bunch more limited entry units don't we.

Colorado seems to again be right here...27 bucks per 100 does. Then it seems that several area could end up like Utah's Pausaugunt, Book Cliffs, or Henry Mountains.

Post by **MuleyMadness** » Thu Jul 27, 2006 7:57 am

Can Utah support more deer? Maybe that is the problem, we simply cannot support a greater number of deer and are struggling to support what we do have.

We could however raise the age objective of bucks harvested across the board and increase buck/doe ratios after post season or on winter ranges.

Nicer deer = happier hunters, which = hunters spending more money and actually hunting more, which would = giving the DWR more money which is what they need and are asking for.

AGCHAWK · Post by **AGCHAWK** » Thu Jul 27, 2006 8:32 am

Man, those numbers sure open your eyes, don't they?! I'm not from Utah but am curious how those numbers would play out in my home state of Washington. Maybe I'll sit down next week (goin' fishin' this weekend) and see how they fall out.

Cowdell · Post by **Cowdell** » Thu Jul 27, 2006 9:38 am

You have some good points there. Like I've said many times before, they need to manage in smaller sized units. Like they do with the antlerless. In your neck of the woods or rocks in SW Utah they really need to cut back on tags not just shorten the season. Why not cut back tags and then have the season longer. I think most people would rather hunt twice as long even if it was ever other year. The winter range down there is in really bad shape and with all the new fires this years it's only going to be worse if they don't reseed alot this fall.

Post by **Hiker** » Thu Jul 27, 2006 10:29 am

Can Utah support more deer? Maybe that is the problem, we simply cannot support a greater number of deer and are struggling to support what we do have.

I think the answer would be, Yes.

Using Colorado as comparison.
CO population = 4,665,177; Square miles of land 103,718
Deer Population (2005) 621,000

UT population = 2,469,585; Square miles of land 84,904
Deer Population (2005) 280,000

The terrain is dryer in Utah, which muleys prefer. Most of Colorado's deer live in North Western Colorado, which is mainly desert country and has had horrible drought, like UT.

thedesertbuck · Post by **thedesertbuck** » Thu Jul 27, 2006 12:03 pm

Wow!!

Post by **MuleyMadness** » Thu Jul 27, 2006 1:12 pm

Thanks for that info HIKER, good post.

Post by **Hiker** » Thu Jul 27, 2006 1:58 pm

Your welcome. If you want any more info, let me know.

This Utah deer situation has perplexed me for sometime now but until we start screaming, nothing is going to happen. It's up to us not UDWR. UDWR knows there is a problem but their hands are tied until we get these "decision makers" off their butts and let UDWR do their jobs.

bigbuck92 · Post by **bigbuck92** » Thu Jul 27, 2006 3:17 pm

ya guys i know it sucks but what do you think they should do about it I want to here what some of ya think they should do

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My thoughts on Utah's Management Plan

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