Hunting in Utah? Quality or apply out of State?

[MuzzyBuck]

So this post is more out of curiousity than anything. But it is my feeling that Native Utah hunters are suffering when it comes down to the Game Management Plan throughout roughly the last 10 or so years. True numbers are increasing in Buck to Doe ratio's across the state, but we can't forget that so are numbers of hunters as well as the dates that tags are beginning to sell out completley each year. This is occuring among elk tags, deer tags, and different seasons and weapons etc. At the same time I find it puzzeling and confusing that someone who has put in for a limited entry elk tag for more than 12 years who hasn't drawn a tag in any of those years but who has 12 points at the max can't seem to draw a tag year after year. Not only in Elk but in once-in-a lifetime hunts and so on. Last year I can remember an article put out by the daily herald about a man in his late 80's or early 90's who finally drew out on a Wasatch Mountains Bull Moose Tag after putting in for an eternity without drawing. Surely this man was maxed out on points but did he just slip through the system for 40, 50, 60 + years!!!! Things like this happen, but then what's even more frustrating are Dude's who are putting in for their wives, grandmothers, daughters, step-sisters, and who all knows who to get a tag that you know their filling for them when they draw out just to increase their own odds! Sadly my father this year somehow lost all his points earned throughout many years on deer and I think he had like 1 Elk point. But the frustrating part was all his deer points are gone. We will be going to the division to talk to them about this but they might not be able to. And it happens often to many that they do not draw on what used to be over the counter regions for the deer general rifle. Know I know that not all can have the same unit, season and there has to be order. But can someone explain to me why a man who has hunted for more than 50+ years in the same state not recieve the tag of his choice on a general season. You can't even begin to talk money that is put into the system through those years through one person let alone others. Sometimes that seams downright robbery!! I can't handle crap like this! I know this is bold but you all know this happens, and I hear of it all the time. Granted their are lot's of great woman hunters out their who are legit and that's awesome and sometimes I wish my own wife were a little more supportive for all my hunting, fishing, hiking, etc... And to add to this for a resident it can cost more to draw out on a Premium limited entry elk tag than it would cost him to go for a non-resident tag and not to mention where they would probably draw out first time or sooner than in Utah. That's not mentioning that the Elk numbers in Utah that used to be desolate and non-existent practically have risen to an unreal amount which is great in some areas like the good quality of herds and bulls in certain area's like LE Units where there aren't enough tags, but bad in that it's crushing good deer numbers, habitat, buck-to-doe ratios in these area's and so on. Granted there is probably to much to respond too in this post but I'm just a chattin'. Also I know that lot's is being done and not all problems can be solved at once nor do I claim to know it all or how to be able to fix them, nor do I claim to know more, or most than anyone else about the system and how it should or shouldn't work. I'm just putting my thoughts out there to hear yours. But all my best memories are of hunting in this state and I'm sure that will remain the same. But I'm really considering trying out are neighbours states to get new experience and to see the quality of hunting they have to offer and try and diversify the seasons, tags and opportunities I could have. Anyway those are just a few thoughts. Now to finish this I just want to say that I am grateful to live in a Free Country where we have the freedom to hunt, fish, and just plain enjoy the good ol' outdoors. I truly am. There's nothing better than seeing a big ol' mossback, or hearin a Bull scream in the early morning or just as the sun is setting. Or to be sitting around the campfire with good friends and good food the night before the opener tellin' bogus stories hearing about the good days and anticipating day break the next morning after all your hard scouting and time in preparing for these few sweet moments that last forever. I am huntings, game managing, fishing, & preservings biggest supporter and fan as I'm sure the rest of you are exactly the same. But that's just it some times it's seems as though it's getting a little harder each year. And I wonder how it's going to be for My boy's and me when I'm my fathers age. (61) By the way. So if you have any thoughts or incites they would be much appreciated and I'll be eager to hear them. I write this really not to bash or to start any argument rather to hear others opinions and incites as to what they experience, have experienced and would like to see happen in the future. Thanks for taking a minute to read and respond.

[Snake River Marksman]

Some people are just lucky. Or put another way, some people have no luck at all! There are WAY more people with max points than there are tags for them. Max points don't guaranty your tags, they're just supposed to up your odds of drawing. Unless it's for a once in alifetime tag, every year more and more people reach max points. At some point, it's just like trying to draw from the general populace. Factor in the out of staters and other people who just put in for points, without really even planning on hunting even if they draw, and it just puts that much more pressure on the system. Call, or better yet, go down to the DNR (FISH AND GAME OR WHAT EVER UTAH CALLS IT) and ask them how to work the system. They can maybe tell you if you can up your odds in some way. Don't just stop with the counter help either. You may have to "kick it upstairs" to get the full story. Just be sure and be "cool, calm and collected" while you're dealing with them. Letting your frustrations get the best of you won't help get you the information you desire.

[MuzzyBuck]

That's some good advice snake river marksman! I will definitley try to remember that when we go! Ha! No but seriously I hear you on that, they'll throw up a wall but I'd also be interested to see really how honest they'll be about everything and to see if they'll actually try to figure out what's happened with my fathers points for the past several years and suddenly dissapearing! Well the hunt's coming soon anyway and that's really the only thing occupying my thoughts all the freakin time!! Ha! Cant' wait.