My thoughts and your thoughts

[tommycaller]

Well as I sat here and read through the posts I notice something that kind of disturbs me. I have been a fair chase hunter for over 35 years, and I have been fortunate enough to get a few good critters. I drew a tag on the Kaibab for this fall and was concerned about making the most of it, so I booked a guide for the first time in my life. I notice that quite a few people seem to be against that. My point is, I don't see anything wrong with my decision. I don't think it makes me any less of a hunter because of that fact. The way I see it, These guys have been in the area for a long time and know the routine these animals use. They know the hidey holes and the migration routes. I live over a thousand miles from there and have absolutely no way to scout the area. Work schedules do not allow me the time to even think about a scouting trip. The hunt is only 10 days long and that doesn't give me alot of time to get to know the area. I have looked at maps and also google earth and still have no idea on where to start. The Kaibab is somewhere around 40 square miles and I'm sure that quite a bit of it is unproductive acreage. So can someone tell me why going with a guide is something that is frowned upon? Just wondering

[Bowtech43]

I think that is just plain stupid!!! Heck if you can afford a guide and it's an area you don't know, more power to you. You are spending a lot of money. I do have a friend who guides however and he has told me about guys who will have him go up on the mountain, find a nice elk/moose/deer and then give the hunter a call. The hunter then drives to the unit, they pick him up in a Ranger and drive him to the animal. The hunter proceeds to shoot the animal and the guide starts the real work of quartering and packing out. Is that hunting? No, not in my book!!! It's shooting, not hunting . But if you are going out with a guide, beating the brush then there is nothing wrong with a little help. These guys that need someone to hold their hand the whole way are kind of a joke in my opinion, but I think there is a difference in what you considering.

My 2 cents...

[killerbee]

well- ---my thoughts: going witha guide is great, absolutly fine, i would do the same thing in your shoes. in fact i guided hunters for 8+yrs. with a great tag that your not familiar with you would be silly not to.

i think the "bad rep" part comes from these guys who buy the gov. tags year after year. they pay guides to sit on a bull for weeks on end until they can come and shoot them. i heard [ for what ever that means--99% of what you hear is rumer--] that at one time there was over 100 guides,between the 2 big outfitters, looking for the spider bull. that to me is just a touch over the top. there comes a point where it is not fair chaise hunting any more. EVERYONE OF US DRAWS ARE OWN LINE!! to each there own . no body can make another hunter's ethics.

lastly--- i had the money i would buy more than one of these tags each year. but i would put in just as much time scouting as anyone!!!


GOOD LUCK ON YOUR GUIDED HUNT! it will be a blast and you WILL be able to make the most of that tag!!!

[AGCHAWK]

Tommy, I agree with bowtech. Hiring a guide for a hunt does not make you any less of a hunter...especially in your situation. I am sure that you plan on wearing out the soles of your boots in order to bag that deer and are also willing to put the extra effort in to ensure that the hunt is a successful one...and the guide(s) are there to assist ya.

I agree with bowtech that sitting at home or wherever, waiting for phone call announcing that a particular animal was spotted, and then arriving long enough to dispatch that animal and mug for photos is what seems to chap a lot of hides.

Heck, BOHNTR, one of our most well respected members here at Muleymadness, utilized a guide for his Arizona hunt this year....and I dare anyone here to even ATTEMPT to say that he is not a true hunter! I know from the years that he and I have been on this site that he does the VAST MAJORITY of his hunts DIY...but felt that this particular hunt called for a little help. (Roy, I hope you don't mind me throwing your name out there. You know I have all the respect in the world for you and what you have accomplished with that trusty bow of yours)

Go for it my friend and enjoy your hunt! Good luck and I hope you get that dream buck that I am SURE is just sitting out here waiting for you to bring him home.

[BOHNTR]

(Roy, I hope you don't mind me throwing your name out there. You know I have all the respect in the world for you and what you have accomplished with that trusty bow of yours)

Not at all Hawk. I totally agree with the others here. I went on my very first guided hunt after chasing critters on my own for 30 years with a bow. I was drawn for an extremely coveted archery tag on the Arizona Strip, which as many know has huge bucks.....but not a lot of them. A guy could literally scout that area for months and never find a great buck in the 5300 square mile area with a deer density of 2000. I knew I needed some help. Luckily, I picked the right outfit that understood my do-it-yourself background and tailored a hunt to my liking and style. Quite frankly.....they were AWESOME......and not only because of the buck I arrowed. I literally made some new friends that have the same philosophy and ethics that I prefer. They're all welcome in my camp anytime.

The only advice I'll give is really check the references of anyone you are considering to guide you if you're going that route. Talk to other outfitters about them too, along with wardens, etc. You'll quickly get a feel of how they're viewed. I didn't pick the "guide" who had the "highest" success rate and would do anything to get me on a buck. I preferred to pick an outfit that worked hard, very honest, and applied absolutely no pressure on me to be successful on only a huge deer. In the words of my new friends Kory, Garrett, and Brady, "It's your hunt Roy, you arrow what makes you happy." I'm here to tell you folks, that attitude is fading in today's hunting world, IMO.

There are a few guides who are reputable for the Kaibab. The outfit I used (At First Light Guide Services-Kory Bundy) know the Bab' as well as Duwane Adams. Here are their respective websites for reference: Good luck and enjoy the experience......it's not a "slam dunk" with a guide on public land......you'll earn it if you're successful, IMO.

http://www.atfirstlightguides.com
http://www.arizonabiggamehunting.com

[MuleyMadness]

Tommycaller,

I completely understand your situation and story and don't shun on you one bit for booking a guide.

I hope it works out and you have a great experience and bag a good buck.

Best of luck, I support your decision. Do you mind me asking who you booked with?

[6x6 bull]

Tommycaller, I will be in the same boat you are in in about 6 years when I draw my LE tag for elk in Utah. Do I have the time and money to drive 3000 miles several times to scout the area? I am sure that I could get some useful info from the guys here but until you put your feet on the ground it is still just info. This hunt will probably be my only shot at hunting elk in UT in my lifetime and I don't want to spend the first week looking for a good place to camp, waterholes, ect. I seem to be leaning more and more these days to letting the Pro's make my once in a lifetime hunt be a success, not that I wouldn't prefer to do it on my own I just don't want to screw up my one big chance to kill a bull over 350.

[sneekeepete]

Tommycaller I agree with everyone else that has posted on this. Booking a guide doesn't make you any less of a hunter. It is the guys who hire a guide to find and set on a animal until the shoot (not hunter) arrives to take his shot. I think we all know you are a good hunter and asking for a little help for an area you are unfamiliar with is a great idea! Good luck I hope you find a monster!

[tommycaller]

Well all of this is good sound info. Thank you all. You know, a guy goes hunting and posts the pic of his trophy and then he says he went guided to get the animal and all of the sudden its like in pro sports...sometimes you get an asterick beside the picture. Kinda puts a wrench in your gears if you know what I mean. I took the advice of some of the folks from this forum when I first logged in here as well as Muley Crazy and others. I called a bunch of guides and most had the same price tag. Most were also 6 day hunts and some do not hunt on Sunday for one reason or another. That means you sit in camp on Sunday or try a little do it yourself. If you kill one on your own then you have to get it out by yourself. I have done that my whole hunting life, but if I am paying for a high dollar hunt, I expect help getting the critter out. I ended up booking with Duwane Adams. He told me his crew will be there for me for the full ten day hunt if needed and Sunday included. I felt that for the same money as the others, this was the best deal for me. I grew up in West Virginia where Sunday hunting at the time was illegal. I understand the philosophy behind this but it is not illegal to hunt on Sunday in AZ. The tag is cheap but the guide is a little tough on my budget. If I am paying, I want all I can get for the money. I also know that a guide does not guarantee that you are going to fill your tag. It's all a matter of preference. A chance you take. Duwane has sent me lots of information and I think I've made a good choice.

[BOHNTR]

Duwane has sent me lots of information and I think I've made a good choice.

You made a great choice. Buckle-up, because you're getting ready for a good time. Duwane is a very ethical guide that knows the Bab' as well as anyone. I personally know a few of his guides.....all top notch folks. Good luck....but most of all have fun!