Dan Eastman and Majestics? why would i disagree

hey Danthe2pointmuleyman;

seems as if it has been awhile since your last post? been hunting, or just busy with work and preparation of the upcoming hunt? i have to wait until the 15th of october before i can go in pursuit of my muley. i am concentrating all my efforts to muley hunting this year, as i have drawn out for a pretty good area that i have been applying for for several years. anyways i have found that unlike most years this year seems to be moving along at a rapid pace. maybe it is the fact that i have been spending alot of time at work or maybe it is because i am just trying not to think about the upcoming season. i am as excited as a five year old on christmas morning, but i am trying to remain calm!

as far as your posts is concerned, i have spent many days watching the outdoor channel, thinking about all these people who are paying for these high dollar hunts and then turning around and talking about all the preparation they went through and all the long hours of hiking and stalking and spotting. and when all is said and done want to try to make all of us believe they worked hard for these animals. and all i can really say is this, B.S.!!!!!!!!!! but on the other hand, i basically try not to concern myself with it and let it bother me because like most of us, we know they are full of it. [-X

i don't have the money, and probably never will, to spend on a hunt. and that is o.k. i don't hunt to try and out do everyone. i hunt for myself and no matter what the outcome i am satisfied. if i hunt long and hard and end up with nothing, that is all good! as long as i know i enjoyed myself.

however, with that being said, sometimes i feel like these animals killed with guides and outfitters and basically someone there to hold there hand the entire time and tell them when to shoot, when to eat, when to drink, and when to sleep, should not be classed in the same class as those animals being taken fair chase. because lets be honest, how many of these guided hunts are truely fair chase. you and i both know the difference between a deer killed on public land that is just absolutely crawling with other hunters and a deer being killed on private property with guides. they are just not the same and should not be classified in the same category. there are exceptions to that, alot of the guides and outfitters that are around the area where i live and hunt, do not hunt private property, maybe on a limited area tag, but not on locked up land. these people are just among the lucky hunters that have been lucky enough to draw a special tag. for example, i drew a limited area tag this year, i will be doing it without guides or horses or four wheelers or anything else, just me, the mountain, and the deer. so if i was to shoot a monster deer, it is no different then if i had a general tag and killed it on public land in the national forest that is crawling with hunters.

i must say another crowd that makes me laugh on the outdoor channel is the boys from drury outdoors. they always seem to be hunting these high dollar hunts with little to no competition and when all is said and done, they have a five minute session of whining and complaining about how much effort it required.

that last post was from me, i forgot to log in! it has been awhile since my last post.

Hey Wymuleyman,

Awesome reply, i agree totally with what u have said and i do watch the outdoor channel also lol I watch these guys complain about the snow or the coldness well i pray for it. I love the snow for the simple fact its easier to track the mulies before an after u shoot an also it gathers up the deer. Not to totally diss on the shows because those are splended mulies gettin pulled out of there and shows how beautiful mule deer are. The reason i havent been around much is because of work an college. I did go up yesterday grouse huntin an got two ruffs. This yr i really broke out the bills but that always means a longer hunting season lol I bought a general Bull Elk Tag and im taking a full week off of work an school to go. It starts on the 9th of October and i am goin to Hoop Lake which is on top on the Uintahs near the Wyoming, Utah border. Than after the Elk hunt ends, the General Mule Deer which starts on the 23 of October and im jus goin to go up on Monte Cristo because i have seen a few boys romin round there and im gonna go see if they wanna play lol I also drew out on the late Ogden South Cow Elk tag and that starts on January 1st so i can't wait for that neither. Im ready for this yr to begin been waitin since last yr for it lol I am at a little bit of a downfall for this yr because i have had no scouting time in which is horrible but what can ya do lol well all of u take care and have a great season this yr

i guess i should make it more clear, i read my post and it makes it sound like i am dissing the boys on the outdoor channel. which was not my intention. those guys are the luckiest boys in the world, and i am envious of them everyday. they pull awesome muleys and elk and everyother species of game, wouldn't that be the life. i just can't help but laugh at some of the ridiculous things they say.


i understand the whole work and college thing, i just graduated almost exactly a year ago to the day. so hunting and school just didn't jive alot of times. however, this is the year! i have plenty of vacation and plenty of money to hit the mountains this year without looking back. to say i am excited would be an understatement.

sounds like an exciting year for you, good luck and i look forward to hearing about the hunts.

So what you two are saying is if you had an extra 100,000 grand in your pocket and hunting was your passion you wouldnt even be tempted to spend 5 grand on a guided hunt? I know I would! Not all guides are bad, I know a couple of guides and they are fair chase on public land....and they harvest nice animals from time to time....and show their clients a good time.
You guys cant say if you won the lottery you would just leave your hunting for public land......knowing that on the private land the animals have had years to grow to their potential. Its not like the deer on private land will let you come up and pet them....you still have to hunt for them! From all of the pressure from the past 100 years of hunting deer have been ingrained with human=RUN or HIDE. I have been on private property watching deer....and they are the same as the deer on public land.....skidish as hell and smart as hell too.
YB

First time I am on this forum, but I am liking it already. As for the shows I don't see many of them. I believe if your watching tv you would be better off out in the field doing something else. But I do see some when traveling and staying in motels, and I am always a little bit jealous. The amount of time spent on a half hour of footage is probably 40 to 100 hours per half hour show. We never see the unproductive hours, and hunting is hunting even if your on private land. The success rates and trophy potential is higher and that is what is paid for. Every person trades time for money or money for time. I decided long ago that time spent in the field was far better than working for money, and paying some guide, so I could spend less time hunting. Not all hunters have come to that point, killing game is status to a lot of folks, and will even shoot them behind a fence.

Hey youngbuck,

first of all let me say, howdy! then let me say ARE YOU CRAZY! of course i would spend that kind of money on one of those "butt burner" hunts, where i can have a guide tell me when to shoot, when to eat, and when to pick my nose. i would absolutely pay to hunt, all i said in my posts, which you would know if you read them carefully, i just can't afford to pay for one. but i would do it at the drop of a hat! all i am saying about these hunts is that it is hard to classify the deer killed on these hunts in the same class as those killed on general, public land! not that those animals don't deserve credit, they are just of a different class. thats all! i also would not consider those type of hunts as real hard or time consuming. not to say that all guided hunts are easy, i think the guides just do an excellent job in providing there hunters quality game with little or no effort on the hunters part. but the effort of those guides should be highly commended. at least for the most part, i am sure there have been bad experiences had by a few people.

Well Hello all of u,

I am not dissing on the sport of Guided hunts or private lands. I have plenty of things i can use the money for. I am satisfied hunting on publics lands with thousands of other hunters, I am not crazy enuff to spend thousands of dollars for a guided hunt so i can get a big Muley. I love to hunt the general hunts and thats just me. If I had alot of money, I would own a big house with a few hundred acres behind it and a trout pond lol but I dont have that much money so im satisfied with what I have now. A two point can big just as big as one of those Mulies they pull out to me. If ya earned it, ya cant be ashamed of that.

Yee-haw !! 16 days until the gun opener in Wyo.

And yeah, I will be utilizing the services of a guide. And I will be hunting on public land. And it will be fair chase. And it won't be easy.

The guide lets us hunt the way we want, shoot when we want, and drink when we want. He is essentially only our point man in the area...doing the scouting in our behalf since we cannot just cruise out to the area (1200 miles from Arkinsaw) any old time we please. And yeah, we pay him for his time and his services; everyone has to make a living.

I guess the point is that we all have limitations: time, distance, money, skill, etc. We must all counteract the limitations we have with those we don't have. Lucky indeed is the man who is wholly self-reliant in his hunting exploits.

That being said, I do find it downright vulgar and insulting to have TV "zoo hunts" thrown in my face as some sort of exercise in sportsmanlike prowess. I know guys who spend mega bucks going to those deer pens in Illinois or those ranches in Tejas to shoot "old number 231" (with a Kimber or a Dakota) chasing a feeder on a jeep at exactly 4 pm(according to their Rolex). They come back with monster mounts and bragging rights and record-breaking trophy stats. I have yet to observe anything in their demeanor that even resembles satisfaction, however.

Maybe my opinion is just a manifestation of a poor old "have-not" being envious of a "have"; perhaps we all work for what we get, regardless of how we get it.

Time/skill = money. It takes one or the other.

wyomingtrophyhunter,
passed through thermop, meetesse, riverton area this past weekend. went up to billings montana to get my new shotgun and some supplies for the upcoming deer season. saw a couple nice deer coming down through the wind river canyon into thermopolis. that is where you are hunting this year, isn't it. i thought about your posts when i saw those deer. the caliber of deer you described just about drove me into the river looking to see if these deer were anything like you described. unfortunately they were not but i have no problem believing the size of deer you described after really looking at the habitat these deer live in. this is without a doubt some awesome country. came back through yellowstone and after coming over sylvan pass on the east entrance i came around a corner and there standing not ten feet off the road was two grizzlies. a mom and her little cub. it was the coolest thing, the first grizzlies i have ever seen.

anyways, i personally don't think there is anything wrong with a guided hunt. i use to guide for a friend back home, my good friend was guided this past few weeks on her sheep hunt, and many other people i know have payed to have a guide. i will tell you one thing that i totally agree with you on, everyone must make a living some how. and guiding hunters is probably one of the hardest ways to make a living. the clients always have high expectations. some, not all, but some expect way more than you can provide and when they go home emptied handed, they want to complain. you would think that a guide or outfitter has got the life. any many aspects of things they do, but it is not all fun and games when you have a paying customer waiting for results.

what i am saying is i do not think having a guide is bad, take your situation for example, how would you do alot of the preparation work for your hunt. when you live 2000 miles away. it is those folks that have the animal handed to them on a silver platter that are just not in the same class of muley as those others that tend to chap my a$%. maybe it is because i am envious, maybe it is because it sucks that i can't afford to do it, i don't know! but i will tell you one thing, if i had the money, BOY I WOULD BE doing it every year.

WYMULEYMAN,

I too know the guide business from the other side. As a kid, we would take old rich (yankee) guys out on the White and Little Red rivers for some of that legendary Arkinsaw trout fishing. You are right: whining and crying at every turn. Not all of them; some were real outdoorsmen who really only needed a local buddy to help them ply their skill. Most, however, were a$$holes who wanted to belittle the guide, his boat, his gear, his knowledge....basically forsake what they had hired the guide to do, only in the name of boosting their own egos. I've heard plenty of times, " Son, let me show you how we do it back home......."

"Well, you ain't at home", is what I had to resist saying to them....and I didn't always hold my tongue either. Lucky thing I got a career outside of public relations, huh ?

I ain't home either when I go to the Wind River country. I try to incorporated every tip I get from my guide. I follow his advice and savvy. He knows the local scam and I do not. Yeah, my basic hunting skills are important. His precision expertise for the area is just as important. We are lucky to hunt with the Wyoming crew that we do. They are regular old fellers just like we are. They don't pressure us to do anything their way. But they know we respect their skills and knowledge and that we are willing to take their advice and do for ourselves and don't have to be coddled. Perhaps our relationship with these cowboys is unique; other outfitters I am acquainted with are quite a bit more anal....and I guess they are because their clientele let them or want them to be that way. Our guys are more like hunting buddies who share their good fortune with us.

All in all (and most guides will tell you this), there are a lot of good folks out there who use a guide. There are just as many, however, who are arrogant and who have unrealistic expectations. The sport is still called "hunting" and that ain't the same as "killing". Most of those canned hunts you see on TV are unrealistic and thus probably contribute more than anything to the ever-growing attitude that buying a hunt is the same as buying a trophy. Sure, the kill-pens can guarantee a trophy. So can most of the private estate hunts. A guide on public lands simply cannot. Nor should he be expected to.

Don't get me wrong, I ain't lecturing you MULEYMAN, cause you know the deal. Glad you got to cruise the Wind/Big Horn river valley. Sorry you didn't see any lunkers. My local guy swears Louie Grande is still there, bigger than ever, along with several that will go 38" and one that is at least 40" !! :-$

And you know my motto,

NEVER SECOND GUESS THE GUIDE !!

Hey,

Thanks for the replies an keeping the topic alive. I like to say this, whether its a guide or a buddy ur hunting with....its how u hunt that makes it a sport. If ur satisfied with just waking up in the morning an drinkin a cup of coffee an round about 8 o'clock u get up on a hill see a deer an your back to camp by 10 well hey thats great. If your like me an ur up at 5 in the morning freezing ur butt off to get to a spot that u think will bring u the best of luck and get skunked lol well thats great too. I hunt with my brother, my dad and my uncle which some can say thats almost the same difference as a guide and IT IS!!!!!!!!!!! My family shares the same love for hunting as i do and so we help eachother whether its spotting deer for one another or letting the guy with the best shot take it or just helping to field dress the animal. Im a lucky guy because i dont hafta pay for them to help me, we just do it out of generosity and its great. It isnt about the guide at all its about how you hunt the animal. If your taking orders from a guide or visa versa, ur giving orders to the guide......thats not right. But if u an a guide share the same love for the sport an u act more like hunting buddies than a guide an his client well thats AWESOME an more power to you. Dont go out there in the woods if you dont respect the sport of hunting an the sport of fair chase because you dont belong in the hills. Its a long tradition that has been passed down generation to generation so dont make greed the thing of the future lets continue on keeping it real an not some rich mans sport. It's a privelage now to even have the chance to go out an experience the mtns an wildlife because there is so many that cant have the same feeling that i do when i get to go. I am spending my money in supporting the wildlife instead of spending mega bucks for the use of a guide. My money is well spent too because i am still provided with the chance to go up an get a trophy animal and all i got to do is spend many days hiking and hunting for it.....thats what the sport is about and i am helping the wildlife in the same motion. I dont diss on guides or rich people neither because guides support the wildlife only if its true wildlife. When guides get paid to have a guy shoot an animal on THEIR LAND......well that isnt helping the wildlife situation at all. The money jus goes straight to the guide to buy his new powerstroke. Hunters have a responsibility to keep public land open an wildlife healthy to provide anybody with the same chance to get their trophy an to go experience the thrill of the hunt because we all dont have thousands of dollars and we all dont have millions of acres. So theres my two cents worth and good luck with all ur hunts everyone.

Well said, Dan.

Besides, I've got the best guide (and buddy) out in Wyoming that you can buy with Ozark mountain moonshine and Arkinsaw muscadine wine. \:D/

Life is good; luck to all.

I am new to this so i hope it works. Please allow me to chime in. Although I love the show, mainly because it is about the only hunting show that actually go after mule deer, apposed to whitetail, I agree whole heartedly with both of you. I hunt in Colo. and live in Calif. I can not afford to hunt private ranches either. I think very little of the huntig shows that take hunters to a planted field and set them in a heated blind while they wait for that buck that they know will come. Wheres the hunt? I hunt with family as well. Dad, brother, son, cousins and friends. We have a large group. We also help each other. If I get lucky and bag a deer, rather it be a trophy or just a meat animal, I will still get up every morning and freeze my butt off to help someone else fill their tag. It is the trip not just the hunt that makes it worth going

nsearchof bigracks;
welcome aboard, i think you will find that although this site does not have the traffic that others have, it is without a doubt the best website that i visit. mainly because the folks around here are ordinary people. and they share the same enthusiasm as i do, to hunt! I also agree with you ten fold. i get really tired of watching whitetail hunts, not that i don't like whiteys, they just seem like the same old hunt, with the same old song and dance each time. i still watch, because i can't lie, i am addicted to hunting, i am sick, i have been to the doctor and there is nothing they can do about it.

one of my roommates came to the house last night with a couple bull elk that an outfitter brought in. i live in jackson hole, wyoming and believe it or not, there are very few outdoor places in town, meaning processing plants, taxidermies, gun shops, gun smiths, basically anything that has to do with hunting, is virtually none existant in jackson. anyways my roommate works at the only processing plant in town and he had to take these heads up to pinedale to a taxidermy shop. got me all excited about the up coming hunt. they were a couple 300 class bulls. CAN'T WAIT UNTIL IT IS MY TURN! only 14 more days.

I have hunted Jackson hole. It was a long time ago. Only four of us went. The rest of our party did not get drawn that year. We took three deer that year but nothing to brag about. In fact one of the deer only had one antler. A three point on one side and nothing on the other. Another one of the deer had a large fork and a little crooked nubby thing on the other. All in all we were a bit disappointed in the hunt. We did not see a lot of action although we did get to see a few moose including one big bull. Our trip to Colo. is also coming up and i too am getting very eager to go. Like you I watch the hunting shows featuring whities because I can't get enough of the sport. I did hunt Idaho once for white tail but was unsuccesful. We saw fresh sign daily but very few deer. My cousin did bag a very nice buck though. Well good luck on you upcoming hunt look forward to reading the details