How do YOU judge a trophy?
sewing
5/28/09 1:02pm
I know some of the answers to this question, but I would like to hear your feedback here. How do you judge a trophy in the field? I know the quality of the hunt is the most important, but how do you know that buck is going to make you as happy when you walk up on it, as it did in your scope?
I start by the width of the ears flat, but I have fooled myself with that one before. I have also talked myself into a smaller buck because the body “looks” huge.
Is there a site that you can go through a series of pics and guess the numbers before seeing the actual answer? That would be great.
It's hard to tell from some peoples hunting pics because the ears are down and the hunter is usually 6 feet behind it to make it look bigger. :-$
I appreciate any feedback and tips.
I start by the width of the ears flat, but I have fooled myself with that one before. I have also talked myself into a smaller buck because the body “looks” huge.
Is there a site that you can go through a series of pics and guess the numbers before seeing the actual answer? That would be great.
It's hard to tell from some peoples hunting pics because the ears are down and the hunter is usually 6 feet behind it to make it look bigger. :-$
I appreciate any feedback and tips.
14,052
Me...I judge it by the amount of effort I put into the hunt, how the hunt played out, who was with me, etc. I have some smaller bucks that I consider more of a trophy than some of my larger bucks. They took me to the limit before I was able to harvest those particular animals while I have some decent bucks that, quite frankly, were pretty easy hunts.
Of course, this is just my opinion. I know there are a LOT of folks that judge them strickly by how they score in P&Y or B&C and I can respect that completely. I would LOVE to have an animal qualify for the "book"...but it certainly does not deminish my hunts or the memories of those hunts if they don't "measure up."
If you shoot first and ask questions later you might have ground shrinkage. If you shoot from long range you might have ground shrinkage.
If you want to use ears you have to know how big the ears are first. Mature deer have larger ears typically than immature deers ears. some areas are prone to smaller ears. example Bookcliffs deer typically have way smaller ears then the Wasatch front bucks. This also goes for their weight.
as for pictures IMHO nothing looks worse than a guy sitting on the hind quarters and having the animals head two feet away from the camera. I also don't like noisy distracting clutter photos.
When I judge deer in the field, I estimate "net" (official) score instead of gross, so when I'm looking at them I take the shortest measurements of each respective side and double it.......then add inside spread. I've been pretty darn accurate using that system over the years.....and you can do it fairly quickly.
I'm basically looking for long main beams, deep forks front-back, good mass, eye-guards, and decent spread. Score isn't everything though......if the buck is mature, I don't have a problem going after it......especially if he's the best I've seen. The buck I arrowed in January was determined to be 7.5 years old.......and he was simply a heavy old 3x3. Not a high scoring buck.......but a trophy none-the-less..........remember......score is simply a number and a guide as to how big it is.
Randy
From your question I assume your refering to B & C. If that is the case then throw out width...more often than not it makes only a difference of a few inches and in many cases will be limited by the length of the main beams. Which leads to where you should look first. The main beam will be the single biggest measurment you have and short beams will significantly lower his score. Then look at the backs (G2) and tine length. Length is key to B & C measurements...as far a mass and width go I would just look for above or below average.
That being said, I personally really like a heavy, wide buck. While they may not score as well they sure look impressive on the wall. If a buck has it all...length, mass, and width, you will know your are looking at something special and I doubt very seriously that you will be disappointed when you walk up to it.
The great thing about mule deer is that there is so much variation in antler configuration. Sometime a buck is just truely unique and for that reason alone would be considered a trophy of a lifetime.
I guess I'm really hoping to get a buck with a 30+ inch spread. That would make me one happy camper. That being said, I love a nice symetrical 4 point and a non-typical with a bunch of junk.
I'd much rather shoot an older, more massive buck with shorter tines and a couple of cheaters than a younger buck with a higher score. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Scout, look around an decide what you like; then go after it. Good hunting.
"Trophy" hunting isn't my thing. But I'm highly selective. I intuitively know when an animal is "right" to be taken and when it's not and a lot of it has to do with my personal sense of fair chase. I'll even go so far as to say that the animal I shoot is a gift from the mountain and it ain't right to take another hunter's gift.
A good friend of mine is in the books with a huge non-typical mulie. But what the book doesn't tell you is that the two of us got tanked the night before and slept in. The deer came through camp right after we'd both just crawled out of bed about 7:30 or so and were making coffee. He shot it in his boxers while I hadn't even thought to grab my bow. What's book-worthy about that?
And of course, we've all heard the folktale about the trophy buck with his leg caught in a cattle guard. Would you shoot or pass?
That isn't to say that a big rack doesn't trip my trigger. Last year, right at first light opening morning, I came on 3 bucks and one of them was huge. He stood there broadside just 30 yards away and although I'm embarrassed to admit it, I was shaking so bad that I couldn't get my release on the loop. I passed on a lot of other bucks over the next 9 days, including his two buddies who were both respectable 4-point bucks, as I chased that buck, trying for another opportunity that I never got. Personal redemption? I don't know - maybe. But I know he didn't get killed last year so I'm after him again this year.
Be selective in your harvest. Be selective in your shot. That's what it's really about, "trophy" or not. Hunt to please yourself and you're probably doing it right.
When ever I hear the word "score" I think of the out come of a game, and hunting by no way or means should ever be considered a competition or a contest....We have nothing to prove when we are in the field except that we are participating in a privelage that includes the exercise of our rights and our actions may directly affect the attitudes of those that are watching and monitoring us....It is our responsibility and endeavor to keep our sport honorable and not to
label it as a gladiator game....
We must never let our own egos jeopardize our rights, sport and tradition...
If you do a little research on the founders of the B&C measuring system it was simply a way to measure antlered and horned animals for statistical data and to rate them against each other......not hunter vs. hunter.........although I do agree, some have seemed to go that way lately.
There's A LOT of bucks that are heavy mature animals that are not conducive to the B&C scoring system. (as NONYA has described) That shouldn't take anything away from what they are......a brute of an old buck that has lived through many seasons. But the fact remains, most hunters out there ask what it grosses or nets, along with some other "measurements" (spread, etc.) when you describe the deer you've taken...........nothing wrong with that either, IMO.
Here is my 2 bits, I'm a mule deer fanatic. :) Having said that the 'kill', or 'score' is not what's important to me, nor is it why I hunt. Actually I've never had one of my bucks scored, not saying I won't in the future...need a bit bigger one. :) A score whether B & C or SCI is simply that a 'score', I think there is value in it for fun to compare...it simply gives a gage on how big a buck is or how it stacks up to others. Having said that, the 'score' means very little to me, but when I kill 'my' monster I may have him scored for curiosity sake.
Now having said that, I will admit I'm a bit picky when hunting do want to find and kill the biggest buck that I can. I love Mule Deer that are unique or different in some way and am a sucker for MASS and EXTRA points. Much rather kill a narrow buck with mass or extra's than a wide willow horned buck.
But here is the thing with me, I'd honestly rather photograph a deer from year to year than kill him. That way I can watch him grow and change from year to year. That's my favorite watching the same buck(s) for multiple or consecutive years.
These bucks are "Trophies" to me.
but one thing that bothers me, alot of guys shoot a BIG buck, they get very excited because it is the buck of their lifetime, they are the first to say"I'VE GOT TO GET THIS SCORED" but then because of something the number dont fit what they thought of their buck. AFTER THAT they are the guys bashing on the B@C scoring system.
we all use it to describe bucks and bulls, so i dont see why some complain about it??
The jist of what I said was not necessarily directed at anyone who has posted here...But because usually there are more readers than respondents, I would hope that any new comers would know that they should never get in the "score rut" and do not let others dictate what they should or should not shoot.....That seemed to be the thoughts of you guys anyway....
IMHO,
Randy
Personally, I'd rather go out and not shoot anything than just take the biggest/only thing I see, but that's just me. Without a doubt, I have gone home empty handed (by choice) far more times than I've gone home with an animal.
Whether you like it or not, scoring is a great way to judge an animal. Pictures can often times be altered or posed in a way that make an animal look huge, or vice versa, so I like to know the score when I see a pic. Other times, someone might say they shot a 26" 4x4....well, what does that mean? It could be anything from a 120" to a 200". Anyway, that's how I look at it...hope no one takes offense to anything I said.
I'm not big on scoring, never have been.
I'm into the over all adventure of the hunt. And I like to put myself into the position of having an opportunity at the best buck an area has to offer. :thumb
I think for those of us that have to drive a ways to hunt Mulies, and no opportunity to scout. Limited to hunting areas where few bucks live long enough to reach their full potential. A buck that has some mass, spreads about 24 inches with good forks is a fine trophy.
That being said, sure do wish more bucks could make it to that 5 plus years.
I think judging a trophy should come from your passed hunting experiences. When I was 16, my velvet spike was an accomplishment and a cherished moment. A trophy if you will. A couple two points and three points later I found myself with a definition of a trophy as any 24" mature 4 point buck. Having never shot a four point, I have passed on many bucks that are larger than the twos and threes I've shot. Many of which would have fit the bill of getting my first 4 point, but they weren't 24" so they got passed upon. Last year I was lucky in my harvest of the buck in my avatar. It really sets the bar high for me. As for all the talk about score, it went 196 2/8" gross. It has two cheaters off one side and one off the other. The cheaters dropped it to 1 2/8" below the minimum all time B&C entry at 188 6/8". That's okay. For me, I love being able to say that I've harvested a 5x6 and the trash is awesome and the buck blows away anything that I've ever shot at or killed. I'm still looking for that 24" plus symetrical 4 point. It could be anywhere from 150 on up and would make me feel like I've achieved the next goal in my hunting experience.
I realize that you have the tag of a lifetime. You are probably very nervous that you'll come home with a buck that doesn't meet the expectations of your peers or your own expectations. That said, I would ask yourself what type of buck have you been realistically pursueing for the last several hunts (years). What type of buck would make you feel like you've accomplished your next hunting goal. That will be a trophy. There are alot of B&C type bucks on the Henry's. My neighbor was down there three weeks ago. Even this late in the shed hunting season he picked up 13 separate sides that were over 80" Those are all 185" + bucks. He saw a live buck that would go 220" and several 190" deer. He also said that when the rifle hunt comes around that many of the tag holders have up to 20 of their friends out glassing for them and that the deer get pushed hard from where you scout them unless you have found a remote spot.
Rather than getting overly star struck by the potential of an absolute monster, I would hold out for a great buck that meets your hunting goals. Who cares what anyone else thinks as long as your happy with the outcome. Best of luck to you. I will likely be one of those "buddies" out glassing for my brothers room-mate who also has a Henry's tag.
I'm not so much worried about my peers, as I am in making the most of great mule deer country. I would like to get a B&C buck, but I'm not obsessed with it. Just trying to put the bar high, so that I will hold out when I see a nice, but not real nice, buck.
I have heard about the pressure down there and I'm scouting for a plan A, and plan B. I always hike anyway, but if they get pushed hard, my plan B is to go in further where most peeps won't hike. I will be scouting out plan B this weekend.
I will keep you all posted.