Pic from yesterday: Question about neck patches on Muleys

Nice photo AGCHAWK! I haven't seen many double throat patched muleys either. =D>

Yea, that is a very cool photo. Haven't seen that much either, great shot. Almost looks like a blacktail.

We need to have Idhunter show us his Idaho buck he got this year. It has one of the most beautiful double patches I've ever seen.

i see alot of them in the same area where we have MD /wt hybrids,i think its a weak hybrid trait.

cool

NONYA, I would normally accept that theory but I have never seen a Whitetail in this particular area before. We have a great mix of Blacktail, Whitetail, and Mulies here in WA but the closest I have seen a Whitetail to this area is about 100 miles east. Not saying that they CAN'T migrate that far but I have yet to see one in here. Nor are there Blacktail this far east of the Cascades.

My theory, I think it's a recessive gene of some sort. Kinda like attached earlobes vice hanging earlobes on us "humans". Of course, I am no biologist so take ANYTHING I say with a grain of salt...LOL

See the white around the eyes as well?Could be a recesive gene Idk...all our deer are in the same areas around here so we see lots of hybrid traits,I shot a very wide MD with a curiously WT shaped rack a few years back,to make things more interesting he was running a ridge with a HUGE wt buck right on his tail.

Now that would be cool. In the wheatfields outside of Clarkston, where I live, you see a good mix of Mulies and Whities "cohabitating". On year I got a nice 4X5 whitetail and my brother downed a 3X4 Mulie within a quarter mile of eachother.

Still a lot of arguements as to whether they interbreed though.

They interbreed ,we see some does that eliminate all question,some are so obvious hybrids that there is no question.

This buck doesn't have a double throat patch, but it does have some short ears and a whitetailish rack - eyeguards. It was killed where both species inter mix. From what I have seen there is no doubt that they inter breed.

Interesting pic, thanks for sharing!

nice pic ironhead

THIS IS THE BUCK I KILLE THAT WAS RUNNING WITH A wT AND HAS A RACK VERY SIMILAR TO A wT.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y7/H3RP3S/MIDNIGHTBUCK22003.jpg" alt="" />

wow thats a awesome buck nonya

Cool pics IRONHEAD, NONYA! Thanks.

I am by no means disputing that they interbreed. I was just sayin' that I hear arguements about it all the time.

I am not near smart enough to make an education decision either way although the pics do make a great arguement.

As for the pic of the doe with the double throat patch. We have a decent mix of whitetail and mulies here in the SE corner of the state but I spotted this particular doe about 100 miles west of here where I have never seen a whitetail before. Again, this also doesn't necessarily mean that it didn't happen with a wandering deer or didn't happen a few generations removed (More likely of the two). I just thought it was cool either way.

After NONYA brought up the interbreeding/hybrid thought I went online and did a bit of research. What did I come up with? Well, it depends on who did the study. Bottom line, I'd stick to solid proof (i.e. pics) and let the big brained folks fight it out.

The most interesting theory I found and the one that most research agreed upon (about 90% out of the 10-15 studies I read) was this:

Whitetail are the oldest of the three species (Mule, Blacktail, Whitetail) and blacktail is the second oldest. Most folks say, based on DNA studies, that a long while back as whitetail pushed west they interbred with blacktail. Over a number of generations (It does not happen overnight) the mule deer was "created". That is why Mule Deer are found between normal whitetail and blacktail habitats and why it is the youngest of the three species. The research is a lot more indebth than that but I didn't want to make this thread a 1000 word thesis so I generalized.
If the whitetail and blacktail can interbreed then I see no reason why whitetail and muleys cannot interbreed. Just my two cents worth.

Thanks again guys.

AGC/ i'm guessing you are a science teacher or something similer. anytime there is a question or a unknown answer to something, you come up with some of the best research answers around! I enjoy reading what you come up with after you do your research! as for the topic on hand, in oregon's north east corner, by joseph/ enterprize, there are a lot of mix breed muley- whitetail cross. you will see deer that look 100% muley except they will have the big flag tail on them. my wife shot a doe a couple yrs back and it was just like that, muley body and face with a big flag tail.

Killerbee, thanks for the compliment. I am not a science teacher but close. I have my degree in Meteorology and Oceanography. I am currently an active duty Navy man but will retire in two more years.

I am also working on my second degree in Natural Resource Management with a minor in Fish and Wildlife Management. Not lookin' to go into that career field. Just doin' it because it interests me (that and the Navy pays every dime of it).

I am just a naturally curious person and quite frankly do not like "not knowing" things. I do a lot of reading and a lot of idol research just because I enjoy it.

Killerbee, I'll have to take a trip down there and see if I can spot one. It would be great to get one on camera. It's only a short drive to the Joseph/Enterprise area so I'll have to free up some time and head out.

I took my biggest Muley thus far in the Joseph Creek area on the WA side of the border.

Here is my Idaho Buck from 2006 that Ridgetop mentioned. It's probably one of the most pronounced double white patches I've ever seen. Once I can find 10 minutes in a day, I'll sit down and share the story.

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g282/PaulNigbur/IdahoBuck2006102LargeWebview.jpg" alt="" />

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g282/PaulNigbur/IdahoBuck2006104LargeWebview.jpg" alt="" />

wow thats a awesome buck

Yep what bigbuck said.

IDHunter

WOW!! Not that is AWESOME! 10sign:

LOVE IT!! You're right too, that double throat patch is awesome! Did ya get a shoulder mount done? I'd be curious to see how it turned out if ya did.

That is THE best cape I have ever seen !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

gREAT BUCK!

Nice muley. I don't think I've ever seen a double throat patch like that on a muley before.

looks like u slit its throat!..not u nonya

beats me those are some good pic though